I take it that you are in contact with John & Eileen Shanahan? - have they been able to help you at all with your research? We have just come back from Valentia and probably won't be going back until next year now but I would be happy to wander around the graveyard and have a look for gravestones for you. (I love doing that sort of thing - I am just starting to research my own family from Valentia) The grave yard is quite overgrown and older graves at the back are sometimes hard to get to. I will sort out a picture of my parent's house (Willie's) and send it to you.

I have spoken to my mother today and she remembers the Cryan's, (especially Girlie Cryan) and other members of the family. I am going over for dinner tonight so I will ask her some stories & info and get back to you

With kind regards

Ann Turner

 

 

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > | Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 00:53:15 +0100 Subject: [CRYAN] Re Cryans in Williamstown Co Galway

Colin Crehan, as a new family historian, asked some questions that others may also like to see the replies to. "What are the LDS Vital Statistics CDs and the Irish BMD Registers and where can I obtain them?" The Church of Jesus Christ and the Latterday Saints (LDS) have microfilmed many parish registers and other documents, relevent to family history in many countries throughout the world. Many of their church buildings have attached to them a Family History Centre where anyone can view these films. If the films are not in stock then the supervisor will borrow it from a central library for a charge. The LDS have produced a sets of CDs for various parts of the world,each with a selection of extracts from Parish Registers and some of the national registers. There is a set for the N America, a set for the British Isles (ie England, Wales, Scotland and all Ireland) and one for Australasia. I am not sure about any others.You may be luck to find the places that you want but not everywhere has been covered. I am sorry not to be able to do any look-ups but my CD with all the names beginning with C has been broken(overuse, I suspect). The Irish National Birth ,Marriages and Deaths(BMD) INDEXES - not registers are also available on film at the LDS FHCs. The telephone number and address of the FHC will be in the Telephone Book. Usually one has to book in advance. However first visit their website http://www.familysearch.org and look in the catalogue to see what is relevant to you . Film numbers and fiche numbers are given so that you can go prepared. The site also gives info. on their CDs Eve - happy hunting

 

Fri, 01 Sep 2000 10:35:55 +0000 Subject: Re: Pat Hunt again From: Patrick Hunt <pathunt@indigo.ie> | To: Caoimhghin O Croidheain

Caoimhghin, Many thanks for your help to date. I now have the names of Thomas Cryan's children. I have an idea that the late Cryan brothers, Tom and Sean, who were remarkable journalists in their day, might have some connection with the Cryan family I want to know more about. Would you mind asking your Dad for the names of their widows, and roughly where they lived in Dublin. I spoke to one widow before; she was rather distressed because her husband died a short time previously. Now I can't remember her name and worse, I don't know which of the two widows she was. Thomas Cryan's children were: Amelia, Thomas, William and Robert. He was married to Mary Casey. If I send you a few paragraphs about this Cryan family, would you mind taking the trouble to put them on the Cryan net group. I don't know how to do it. Many thanks, Pat Hunt

 

Cay145@aol.com | Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2000 10:54:35 EDT Subject: Fwd: Cryan surname/help

Kevin, I am Dorothy Catherine Cryan Chegwidden. I have recently been given information about my great-great grandfather Michael Cryan and his wife Bridget Foley Cryan. They were from Ireland and came to the U.S. They had children Margaret J. , Nellie T., Mary A., and John P. all born in Ireland. I'm not sure if there were others born there, but they had others here in the U.S., including Nora, Michael, James, Bertha B. Annie and maybe Helen. Michael and Bridget both died in the U.S., but I would like to know if you have any information on births of their children or their own births or their parentage, etc. I would appreciate any help. I had assumed that they were from Sligo or Rosecommon from the many inquiries of Cryan families that I've seen, but I don't know. I do know that Bridget Foley Cryan had a sister Mary married name in U.s. Murray who moved to Dixon, Neb. That's all I know of the ones who early on came from Ireland. I'm just now connecting with the U.S. information. My father Richard G. Cryan was born in Lowell, MA, as were his many brothers to John J. Cryan, who had a brother Leo C., also born in Lowell. Their father was John P. , who was born in Ireland. That would be my great grandfather. Am I confusing you? I seem to be myself. Any help or knowledge of where to look for help would greatly be appreciated. My dad died when I was five in the state of Kansas, and I have no real knowledge of my family. Dottie Cryan Chegwidden, Corpus Christi, TX

 

SSulli1128@aol.com | Date: Sun, 3 Sep 2000 12:44:50 EDT Subject: Valentia Island Cemetery

I recently visited Valentia Island in July. I was in search of any relatives that may still be living there. I spent several hours at Kylemore Burial Grounds photographing headstones. I could not located William and Eliza Shannahan in my collection, however I do have pictures of other Shannahans and O'Sullivans and a Stephen Cryan. If you would like a CD of those photo's please send me your snail mail address. The CD is not a complete list of all the graves at the cemetery. The cemetery is badly over grown and difficult to walk through. I was being attacked by flies during my stay and was unfortunately unable to complete my project there. You are welcome to what I have, as I know how hard it is to do the research. Regards, Steve Sullivan

 

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > | Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2000 13:00:15 +0100 Subject: [CRYAN] Michael CRYAN of Lowell MA

Hi List-readers

 

I have recently been reading the Ballaghadereen RC parish registers and

collecting more CRYANs. By chance, I received a notice from another

list

that someone was looking for Michael CRYAN and Bridget FOLEY who went

from

Ireland to Lowell MA.

 

Wake -up all you Lowall researchers, do you know who this Michael is ?

Is

he the one with the shop or is he one of the others? I remember some

census

data that someone posted. Please would someone kindly resurrect it for

all

to see.

 

Hopefully Dottie has re-subscribed by now - WELCOME

 

Until again, happy hunting Eve

...............................................

>From the RC parish registers of Ballaghadereen which is a

town on the borders of Counties Roscommon, Mayo and Sligo, I can offer

a

 

Marriage of Michael CRIEN/CRYANto Bridget FOLEY on 4 Sept 1864

witnesses John CRIEN/CRYAN and Mary HAYDEN

 

Mary ...bapt on 24 July 1865 parents Michael CRYAN and Margaret(I think

that

this is a mistake by the writer), should be Bridget FOLEY

witnesses John FOLEY and Mary FOLEY

 

Diff to readname but probably Hony(short for Honora, which has another

diminutive NORA)...bapt 14 Feb 1867 parents Michael CRYAN and Bridget

FOLEY

witnesses John CRYAN and Mary PLUNKETT

 

Anne....bapt 27 Nov 1868 parents Michael CRYAN and Bridget FOLEY

witnesses Pat PLUNKETT and Bridget PLUNKETT

 

All these are from the townland of Grophy, which I can not find on my

map.Perhaps it is too small or it has been absorbed in to a

neighbouring

townland,but as all the other townlands

 

 

Voltene@aol.com | Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2000 10:12:49 EDT Subject: [CRYAN] Michael and Bridget (Foley) Cryan

Hi Group, I have been putting together my own database of CRYANs, not only in Lowell, but In MA 1860-1905, Births, Marriages and Deaths. Unfortunately, I only have obituaries for Cryans in Lowell. I was able to forward to Dottie the following obits for Michael and Bridget (Foley) Cryan. If Jill is still on the list, check out one of the bearers at Mary Cryan's funeral. Lowell Sun, 8 June 1899 Obituary Michael Cryan, an old resident of Lowell, died last evening at his house, 23 Fayette street. He was an esteemed member of the Holy Name Society of the Church of the Immaculate Conception. He leaves a wife, three sons, James, John and Michael, and six daughters. ---- Lowell Courier Citizen, Monday 19 Dec. 1921 Obituary Mrs. Bridget Cryan, and old resident of the Immaculate Conception parish, but for the past few years a resident of the Sacred Heart parish, died Saturday at her home, 27 Bourne street, off Moore street. She leaves six daughters, Mrs. Patrick Murphy, Misses Bertha, Annie, Helen, Margaret, and Nora Cryan; two sons, John and James; one sister, Mrs. Mary Murray of Dixon, Neb.; three grandchildren, John and Leo Cryan and Mrs. Aloysia Halloran, and two great-grandchildren, Ilene and Nora Frances Halloran. Bearers at the funeral, James O'Flahaven, Michael McKeon, Charles Sadlier, Patrick Kenney, Hugh McNiff, James K --- Another son, Michael Cryan, died in 1911. On his 1902 Naturalization in Lowell Police Court, it lists his place of birth as Balladereen, Co. Sligo, Ireland and date of birth as July 5, 1881. According to the Naturarization, he came to America at the age of 11 months, arriving about June 9, 1882 to the port of New York. Hope this helps anyone researching this family. Thanks Eve for the dates of marriage and baptisms. Karen Murphy Nashua, NH

 

Cay145@aol.com | Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2000 19:57:01 EDT Subject: [CRYAN] Michael and Bridget (Foley) Cryan

Hello,To the people doing Cryan research in Lowell, MA and in Newark

, N.J.

I am trying to find the descendants as well as the ancestors to the

Michael

and Bridget Cryan.So far Eve and Karen have helped a great deal in

locating

these family members and some of the children.They are my great-great

grandparents.My great grandfather is John P. Cryan, born in Ireland.

His

son John J. Cryan is my grandfather.John Joseph married Catherine

Dubey in

Lowell....she was from Cambridge, I believe.They had John, Richard

(my dad,

born in 1925, died in 1950), Ralph, Robert, Catherine Doris, Raymond,

the

latter born in 1930.They moved to Newark, New Jersey sometime around

the

last child's birth.I believe my grandfather John J. died in Irvington

or is

buried there in 1964. Catherine, grandmother, died in 1931.

I've lost touch with the Aunt Doris, who used to write, and now do

not know

if any are alive or well, but I know they have families in the Newark

area.

So if any of you out there in Newark know this family, I would

appreciate

your information.I think Ralph died very young, maybe in the war.I

don't

know about the others.If you have access to obits in the Newark area,

I

would appreciate ones on any of these family members.I would

especially

like to see the ones for grandfather John Joseph in 1964 and Catherine

(Dubey) Cryan in 1931.These might help in identifying the others.

Thank

you again if you are researching in the area.Dottie in Corpus

 

 

Cay145@aol.com | Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2000 22:34:47 EDT Subject: Re: [CRYAN] Dolans of Roscommon and Leitrim & Cryan

Dear Caoimhghin@yahoo.com

I have recently discovered more about my family through this list and

other

Cryan sites...and wonderful people, such as Karen and Eve.My

great-great

grandfather Michael spelled his name Crien/Cryan when he married Briget

Foley

in Sept 4, 1864.I believe he had a brother John who spelled his name

Cryan

who attended the Michael andBridget's daughters' baptismal services

of

Nora, Mary, and Anne in 1865-68. They were baptized in Ballaghadereen

and

seemingly from the town of Grophy in that area.Michael and Bridget

and ten

children settled in Lowell, Mass. But his great-great grandson, John

settled

in Newark, New Jersey.(and his familyof many children)

 

But I don't find an Agnes Crine in the family. Do you think this must

be

another family of Crien's or Cryan's or Crine's??????? I think it might

be,

but I thought I'd see if you had any more info. that might

relate.......or

see if this would help you.Dottie

 

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > | Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 17:13:23 +0100 Subject: [CRYAN] Ballaghadereen Registers

Hi Patrick,

Although I do not live in the USA, I have been able to visit the local

Family History Centre (FHC) of the Church of Jesus Christ and the

LatterDay

Saints(the LDS) - they are open to the public and I believe that there

is

one in Dublin. The phone book should give the address

 

They have a huge collection of films and fiches associated with

genealogy

from all over the world. These include films of parish registers. You

will

be pleased to know that you can access their catalogue, as well as a

great

amount of data, through the internet . If you click on this URL you

should

get through and then go through the links to the bit that you want.

†††††††††† http://www.familysearch.org

 

However the film number for Ballaghadereen is 1279232.

 

This film however may have to be ordered if they do not keep it in

stock, so

it is worth checking by phone first and they will tell you how much it

will

cost (here in England it is £4 for a loan of 3 months) and how to pay.

They

are very helpful. They will let you know when it is available to

use/read on

one of their film readers and you will most probably have to book as

the

film readers are well used.

 

On the film of The Ballaghadereen Registers there are different

sections

1 Baptisms Nov 1851 - 1860

2 Baptisms 1861 - 1870

3 Baptisms 1871 - 1875

4 Baptisms 1876 - 1884

5 Baptisms 1885 - 1895

6 Baptisms 1896 -

7 Marriages Aug 1830 - 1867

8 Marriages 1868 - 1873

9 Marriages 1874 -

also

10 Ballymote Marriages 1824 - 1865

11 Ballymote Marriages1866 - 74

12 Ballymote Marriages1874 -

13 Ballymote Baptisms 1856 - 76

14 Ballymote Baptisms1877 -

15 BallymoteBaptisms and Marriages 7 Dec 1874 - 1909

16 Killasser Baptisms 18? possibly 1848

17 Killasser Marriages 1847 -

 

I have extracted all the CRYANs CRIENs CRENS etc up to 1870 but have

not

found an obvious candidate for your Thomas CRYAN except

 

******* 5 Jan 1853 Thomas CRIENparent Patrick CRIEN (no mother

given)

witnesses James Gallagher and Mary Carty

 

Townlands aregiven after 1860, after which time there are CRYANs and

variants in the townland that you mention - many of them are spelled

phonetically

Thus there are Cryans in Fallens, Fauleens,Faleens, Sharriff,Grophy,

Cloghan,Clogher, Boherlee, Banada

More,Creggane,Keelbanada,Castlemore,Ballaglin and Icelawn.

 

**********As a "local" ,do you know where the townland of Grophy is. I

can

not find it on my OS map which gives a lot, but not all, of the

townlands

listed ?

 

There are CASEYs but I have only those married to CRYANs and I presume

the

marriage between Thomas and Mary took place after 1872 , so it should

appear

in the part that I have not collected, together with their children.

 

Good luck Eve

I am sending some of this to the CRYAN list as well as to you directly.

Thu, 09 Sep 1999 07:03:49 -0400 From: Margeret Dolan <mrdolan@hgo.net> | Reply-to: mrdolan@hgo.net

Dear Kevin, I can't say for sure, but it certainly is close to where the rest of them are.....are you going to try to come to the reunion next August? I hope so....keep in touch, and I'll get back to you with Dolan info......PeggyD Caoimhghin O Croidheain wrote: > Hi > My great great grandmother was a Margaret Dolan who > married Master John Cryan of Boyle and Croghan After > his death she went to live in Carrick-on-Shannon near > some other Dolans who were possibly relatives. > Does anyone have any info taht throw some light on > these Dolans or where they wer from in general? > Thanks > caoimhghin > (Kevin Cryan)

 

Cay145@aol.com Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 12:20:42 EDT Subject: hello from a Cryan To: caoimhghin@yahoo.com

Kevin,

This is Dottie Chegwidden (Cryan) from Corpus Christi, TX., originally

from Kansas.Eve and Karen from the Cryan mailing list have discovered that

my great-great grandfather, Michael Crien/Cryan married a Bridget Foley in

1864 in Ballaghadereen RC Parish.They were from Grophy, we think. Anyway,

Michael and Bridget had several children there.....and then moved to

Lowell,

Mass. I think Michael must have had a brother, John......not sure about

the others.......and Bridget had a sister Mary who married a Murray and

moved to Nebraska.Do you find any connections here?

My father Richard George Cryan died when I was five, so I've been

trying to trace down family for a long time.I know my grandfather John J. Cryan

was born in Lowell, Mass. and moved to Newark, N.J. with his family.His

father was John P. who was born in Ireland, I assume in the area mentioned

where Michael and Bridget were married.Confused? I am a little.Well, I

thought I'd check to see if there are connections here........take care.

Dottie

KBri490226@aol.com | Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 19:11:09 EDT Subject: 1911 news article To: caoimhghin@yahoo.com

Rec'd thenewspaper articletoday. Boy, it suremade news didn't it.

I really enjoyed readingit. Thanks again for sending it to me. Do you

live in caherisiveen? kathleen

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > Date: Wed, 6 Sep 2000 01:31:39 +0100 Subject: [CRYAN] Robert CRYAN To: CRYAN-L@rootsweb.com

Leslie,

You wll be pleased to know that I checked the Irish Register Indexes

forFrancis Fox 's marriage which is 1871 in Galway with index number

14.131....the same as Robert.

So yes it is the one

Eve

Wed, 06 Sep 2000 18:57:19 +0000 Subject: Re: Pat Hunt again and again From: Patrick Hunt <pathunt@indigo.ie>

Caoimhghin, I am so sorry. I thought that Des Cryan was your father: it was he who put me in touch with you in the first instance. It was an assumption I made, nothing he wrote. What I wanted to know is how or where I could contact the widows or family of the late Tom and Sean Cryan. I was in touch with one of the Cryan widows a couple of years ago; her husband was not long dead; I did not push the matter; now I can't remember which widow she was. I have already been in touch with some of the Cryan contributors on the list. They are wonderfully enthusiastic people. I wish people of my surname were as good. I will be in touch. Best wishes, Pat Hunt > From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> > Date: Wed, 6 Sep 2000 05:56:27 -0700 (PDT) > To: Patrick Hunt <pathunt@indigo.ie> > Subject: Re: Pat Hunt again > > Hi > > > My uncle Des Cryan worked in the papers and I can ask > him but I am in Belgium till 16th of Sep. My father > died in 1990. > > Please do send any information about any Cryans and I > will post them on the list as there are lots of > researchers who can be very helpful on the list > as they have so much inforamtion collected now. > > regards > caoimhghin > > > > --- Patrick Hunt <pathunt@indigo.ie> wrote: > > Caoimhghin, >> >> Many thanks for your help to date. I now have >> the names of Thomas >> Cryan's children. >> >> I have an idea that the late Cryan brothers, Tom >> and Sean, who were >> remarkable journalists in their day, might have some >> connection with the >> Cryan family I want to know more about. Would you >> mind asking your Dad for >> the names of their widows, and roughly where they >> lived in Dublin. I spoke >> to one widow before; she was rather distressed >> because her husband died a >> short time previously. Now I can't remember her name >> and worse, I don't know >> which of the two widows she was. >> >> Thomas Cryan's children were: Amelia, Thomas, >> William and Robert. He was >> married to Mary Casey. >> >> If I send you a few paragraphs about this Cryan >> family, would you mind >> taking the trouble to put them on the Cryan net >> group. I don't know how to >> do it. >> >> Many thanks, >> >> Pat Hunt

 

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" <To: "Caoimhghin O Croidheain" <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: in general.... Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 15:41:51 +0100

Hi,

It sounds a good idea in theory but most of my information is on a card

index and sheets of paper - doing that part of the 1901 census for

Roscommonwas quite enough.

And ....the only conversations on the list would be of the type

...."whereis....?"" Look in...." type. One can at least interact and stimulate

others to interact.

Anyway, I believe that one should try to look at the information for

oneself, not believe the thousands of lists that should only be giving

apointer in the right direction. If one looks at even a film of the

parishregisters one learns a great deal about the time that it was written -

no-one seemed to believe me when I said that the same surname can be

spelledseveral different ways even within one family because the person/priest

whowrote it, heard and interpreted what the informant said in a different

way.One has to see to believe !!! (where have we heard that before?).

There is also the possibility that if one looks at the parish register

onecan trace other parts of the family.

I shall carry on as now, for the time being.

Regards Eve

 

How is the thesis getting on

KBri490226@aol.com Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 12:02:24 EDT Subject: Re: 1911 news article

Hi, I relly don"t know if Timothy was a relative, as I have not been able to get past my grandparents for info on the family. I got the name of a Morley from the Valentia website and wrote to him on Valentia in Aug. ; but have not received a reply. I will keep looking , being retired gives me plenty of time. I was wondering how would you pronounce your first name or what would be the english eqivalent? I am planning on taking a Gaelic course at a local college in Jan. kathleen

noreen o' sullivan" <norosul@hotmail.com To: caoimhghin@yahoo.com Subject: Re: Valentia Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000

From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> >To: "noreen o'" sullivan <norosul@hotmail.com> >Subject: Valentia >Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 14:09:30 -0700 (PDT) > >Hi Noreen >Could you tell me if there is a heritage centre on >Valentia ? >I know there is a Museum ...could you give me the >address again? I would like to find out if the old >graves have been surveyed as I would like to find the >graves of my great great grandparents William Shanahan >and Eliza O'Sullivan and their parents etc... > >Does the museum have a web site or address? > >Thanks again >caoimhghin (Kevin Cryan) >Dear Caoimhghin, Sorry for delay i replying,our computers were down with eircom bug. There is only a museum in Valentia not a heritage centre,perhaps they may be able to help you.they are at Knightstown,Valentia. Slan, Noreen. >

 

Cay145@aol.com Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 22:39:32 EDT Subject: immigration site

www.nara.gov/geneaology/immigration/immigrat.html

sorry, if I forgot to paste ....Dottie

Bibliographies

Filby, P. William, ed. Passenger and Immigration Lists Bibliography,

1538-1900. 2d ed. Detroit, MI: Gale Research Co., 1988.

Lancour, Harold, comp. A Bibliography of Ship Passenger Lists,

1538-1825;

Being a Guide to Published Lists of Early Immigrants to North America.

3d ed.

New York: New York Public Library, 1978.

 

Wood, Virginia Steele. Immigrant Arrivals: A Guide to Published

Sources.

Revised. (Washington, DC: Library of Congress, Local History &

Genealogy

Reading Room, n.d.).

 

 

Compilations

Carl Boyer and Michael Tepper, each using a different format, have

undertaken to publish the names in Lancour's lists. Tepper's coverage of Lancour

is not comprehensive: an inventory of those articles omitted appears on pages

viii, ix and x of New World Immigrants.....

Boyer, Carl. Ship Passenger Lists, National and New England

(1600-1825).

Newhall, CA: C. Boyer, 1977. Covers Lancour entries 1-71.

 

Boyer, Carl. Ship Passenger Lists, New York and New Jersey (1600-1825).

Newhall, CA: C. Boyer, 1978. Covers Lancour entries 72-115.

 

Boyer, Carl. Ship Passenger Lists, Pennsylvania and Delaware

(1641-1825).

Newhall, CA: C. Boyer, 1980. Covers Lancour entries 116-197.

 

Boyer, Carl. Ship Passenger Lists, the South (1538-1825). Newhall, CA:

C.

Boyer, 1979. Covers Lancour entries 198E-243.

 

Tepper, Michael. New World Immigrants: a Consolidation of Ship

Passenger

Lists and Associated Data from Periodical Literature. Baltimore:

Genealogical

Publishing Co., 1979.

 

Tepper, Michael. Passengers to America: A Consolidation of Ship

Passenger

Lists From the New England Historical and Genealogical Register.

Baltimore:

Genealogical Publishing Co., 1977.

 

Tepper, Michael. Emigrants to Pennsylvania, 1641-1819: a Consolidation

of

Ship Passenger Lists from the Pennsylvania Magazine of History and

Biography.

Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., 1978

 

Tepper, Michael. Immigrants to the Middle Colonies: a Consolidation of

Ship

Passenger Lists and Associated Data from The New York Genealogical and

Biographical Record. Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Co., 1978

 

 

Ethnic Groups

There are numerous published name indexes to 16th through 19th century

arrivals of persons of various ethnic groups, including persons of

Czechoslovakian, Dutch, English, German, Irish, Italian, and Russian

descent.

For a listing of some of these indexes, see:

 

Wood, Virginia Steele. Immigrant Arrivals: A Guide to Published

Sources.

Revised. (Washington, DC: Library of Congress, Local History &

Genealogy

Reading Room, n.d.).

 

Two online guides to immigration by particular ethnic groups are:

 

Douglas, Lee V. Danish Immigration to America: An Annotated

Bibliography of

Resources at the Library of Congress. Research Guide No. 28.

(Washington, DC:

Library of Congress, Local History & Genealogy Reading Room, n.d.).

Douglas, Lee V. A Select Bibliography of Works: Norwegian-American

Immigration and Local History. Research Guide No. 6. (Washington, DC:

Library

of Congress, Local History & Genealogy Reading Room, n.d.).

 

Part 3: 1820-1959

 

Fri, 8 Sep 2000 04:33:53 PDT From: Karen McElrath <K.McElrath@Queens-Belfast.AC.UK> Reply-to: K.McElrath@Queens-Belfast.AC.UK Subject: [CRYAN] Re: irish townlands

received this info from the ancestry.com news.most of it focuses on

the north of

ireland, but some information might be useful (karen)

 

=============

"IRISH TOWNLANDS: BEYOND THE DEFINITION," by Sherry Irvine

============================================================

Townlands turn up in Irish research and nowhere else. It is an unusual

term--asI type this article, every use of the word has a red underline. The

spell checkthinks two words have been run together by mistake. Set out on the

trail of anIrish ancestor, however, and you will discover townlands.

It is easy enough to gather some basic facts about townlands. You will

quicklylearn that they are important for research because certain records were

collected or recorded with townland as the basic division. Townlands

are anancient land unit and once numbered more than 60,000. However, finding

them onmaps can sometimes be difficult.

 

All of this is essentially true, but it leaves out much of the

story--pointswhich were brought home to me during a visit to Northern Ireland in

April.Needing a change one afternoon, I abandoned my research and went to the

UlsterMuseum and there came across the 30 panels of a traveling exhibit,

"CelebratingUlster's Townlands." This explained a lot. The townland existed long

before the14th century, perhaps from as early as the 1100s. It was a meaningful

entity,and it was how a small, local community identified itself. Townlands

seemed toderive from what defined a family holding, and in some rural areas

until recenttimes, the townland name was the postal address.

 

Boundaries of townlands were expressed in terms of notable natural or

man-madefeatures of the landscape, such as hilltops, rivers and streams, walls,

orroads, and very often it was these features that became the names of

townlands.Landmarks, trees, plants, and animals all appear among the names;

Eglish(church), Fofanny (thistle place), and Rosnamuck (wood of the pigs) are

threeexamples ("Celebrating Ulster's Townlands," by Kate Muhr, Ulster

Place-NameSociety, 1999).

 

The townland is the smallest administrative division, and all other

divisionsare made up of townlands. Anywhere from five to 30 townlands comprise

one civilparish. In other words, size varies from the smallest, which is less

than twoacres, to the largest--more than 7,000 acres. This is an indication of

landquality: the better land was divided into smaller townlands.

 

At the time of the Plantation of Ireland, part of the policy of

resettlement wasto introduce the English system of land tenure. In their leases, the

proprietorsdescribed land according to townlands for the simple reason that there

was in1608 no proper survey of the confiscated areas. In addition, for the

severalgeneral land surveys later in the 17th century, the townland was the

basic landunit. Thus it became standard in land transactions, and estates were

mapped withreference to townlands.

 

The first effort to create a generally accepted list of townland names

came atthe time of the Down Survey, 1655-59. This was the work of Sir William

Petty,who took an interest in the ancient names and in retaining them, but

who had apreference for expressing them in English. The list was published about

70 yearsago as "A Topographical Index of the Parishes and Townlands of Ireland

in SirWilliam Petty's Manuscript Barony Maps 1655-59" (ed. By Y.M. Goblet,

Dublin,1932).

 

Nearly 200 years later, the British government undertook a townland

survey of

Ireland to create a detailed mapping at a scale of six inches to the

mile. The

maps were to be supplemented with "aide-memoires," or written

descriptions of

details that could not fit on the plans. The Ordnance Survey Memoirs,

completed

only for the northern counties, were the result. On the maps, townlands

were all

marked, including some newly created, generally those identified with

prefixes

like Upper, Lower, North, South, etc. John O'Donovan was hired to

standardize

the names so that duplication was avoided. His workbooks survive in

Ireland and

can sometimes help in the identification of a place name. It was this

official

mapping that made permanent the townland names found in the various

indexes, in

particular the widely available "General Alphabetical Index to the

Townlands and

Towns, Parishes and Baronies of Ireland Based on the Census of Ireland

for the

Year 1851" (originally published in 1861; reprinted, GPC, 1984).

 

Records based on townlands and commonly consulted by genealogists are

census

returns, tithe applotments, Griffith's Primary Valuation and subsequent

valuations, taxes, deeds, the spinning wheel lists, rentals of estate

lands, and

maps. Knowing the townland where ancestors lived may prove significant

in

setting a family apart from others of the same surname. To be useful,

however,

the townland needs to be in context--what parish, barony, and county is

it in?

However, sometimes the problem is the reverse: the townland is unknown,

and a

record must be used to discover it.

 

To place a townland, begin with the one of the various indexes to

townlands

published in association with the census returns (one was mentioned

above, and

others can be found by referring to the Family History Library Catalog

(tm)

under Ireland - Gazetteers). You can search for townlands on the

Internet at

http://www.seanruad.com. Townlands can also be referenced according to

the Poor

Law Unions created in the middle of the 1800s ("Townlands and Poor Law

Unions,"

by G.B. Handran, Higginson, 1997).

 

If a family can be positively identified, then records such as

valuations and

tithe applotment books will indicate which townland a particular family

lived in

at that point in time. On the other hand, knowing the townland does not

automatically pinpoint location. Among the 60,000 and more names, there

is

duplication. Also (though not such a difficult problem), it may not be

possible

to distinguish between a townland name and the name of the parish,

e.g.,

Faughanvale Townland is in Faughanvale Parish in County Londonderry.

 

Knowing the townland focuses research, both geographically and with

respect to

records. As far as geography is concerned, one example is the modern

discoverer/discovery series of maps--1:50,000 sheets issued by the

OrdnanceSurvey offices of Ireland and Northern Ireland; these include townland

names.For records, the Registry of Deeds is an example. It has an index to

grantorsand a place index based on townlands that allows searching by region,

whether ornot your ancestor was a likely grantor.

This article began with the traveling exhibit "Celebrating Ulster's

Townlands,"which started its journey in Fermanagh in 1999 and will wander in and

out ofWales and southwest Scotland, as well as across Northern Ireland, into

nextyear. It is the work of the Northern Ireland Place-Name Project, which

comesunder the Department of Celtic Studies at The Queen's University of

Belfast. TheInstitute of Irish Studies (http://www.qub.ac.uk/iis/) at the

university haspublished a "Dictionary of Ulster Place-Names" (Patrick McKay, 1999)

and thefirst seven volumes of The Place-Names of Northern Ireland (so far

covering Downand parts of Antrim and Derry).

 

EDITORíS NOTE: For those planning on visiting Ireland in the next few

months, aschedule for the traveling exhibit "Celebrating Ulster's Townlands" is

availableonline at: http://www.niclr.com/timequest/pages/placena.html

Cay145@aol.com Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 23:22:33 EDT Subject: canada cryan's

Hi all,I thought if you hadn't discovered this place, you might find it

interesting.the web site ishttp://www.valleyweb.com/victoriasinn

Their e-mail address is victoria.inn@ns.sympatico.ca

<A HREF="http://www.valleyweb.com/victoriasinn/">Victoria's Historic

Inn & Carriage House</A> Dottie

 

Cay145@aol.com Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 11:10:26 EDT Subject: cryan / crien

This list from Delaware Co., NY Genealogy and Hist. Site has a Patrick

Crean,

a Michael Crine, Michael Cryan and thomas Cryan listed on it for anyone

who hasn't seen this....Dottie

www.rootsweb.com/`nydelawa/naturali.html <A

HREF="http://www.rootsweb.com/~nydelawa/naturali.html">Naturalization

Records, Delaware Co., NY</A>

Sun, 10 Sep 2000 20:29:20 +0000 From: Patrick Hunt <pathunt@indigo.ie> Subject: [CRYAN] The College in the Bog

Hello all Cryan folk, In the last 20 years of the 19th Century a village schoolmaster called Thomas Cryan flourished in a townland called Townabrack, located between Monasteraden and Gurteen in South Co Sligo, close to the shore of Lough Gara. So successful was Master Cryan at securing scholarships for his pupils that his little school became known as ĆThe College in the BogĻ. Even children from distant parts took lodgings with local families so that they could drink at this extraordinary fountain of knowledge. Thomas Cryan was born in the early 185Os and died in September 1904. His place of birth was probably Fauleens, a townland often incorporated into Shroove in various records. He married Mary Casey who came from a townland in Monasteraden. They had four children that I know of: Amelia, William, Thomas and Robert (Bertie). I have heard that Bertie died young of TB. I traced William and Thomas to Clongowes Wood College in Co Kildare, where they were outstanding students in the 1890s. Thereafter the trail runs cold. Why? One tradition has it that one of the boys, either William or Thomas, was killed in a motor cycle accident in the 1920s or 1930s. The other boy, either William or Thomas, may have emigrated to Canada. Amelia? The first rumour I heard about her was that she became a journalist with The Times of London. The first hard piece of information I gathered about her was that she worked for the League of Nations in Geneva. At one stage she returned to Co Sligo and brought with her the first ever radio in that part of the country. That would have been in pre-Radio Eireann days. I am desperate for leads in my search for descendants (if any) of those Cryan children or anecdotes about their extraordinary father. I find it extraordinary that so little is known about Master Cryan and his family. It may be that his wife and children left the area after 1905 to live in Dublin. Can anybody help me. Pat Hunt 3 Rosslyn Court Bray Co Wicklow pathunt@indigo.ie tel. Dublin 286 0798

 

Mon, 11 Sep 2000 05:54:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: [CRYAN] Cryan Commonwealth War Graves

The Commonwealth War Graves Commission http://yard.ccta.gov.uk/cwgc/register.nsf In Memory of HENRY CRYAN Ordinary Signalman P/JX619995 H.M.S. Moreta., Royal Navy who died on Thursday, 11th April 1946. Age 20. Additional Information: Son of Patrick and Ellen Cryan, of St. Helens, Lancashire. Commemorative Information Cemetery: BEIRUT WAR CEMETERY, Lebanese Republic Grave Reference/ Panel Number: 9. C. 1. Location: Beirut War Cemetery is located approximately 2-3 kilometres from the centre of Beirut in the El Horj district on Rue Jalloul, which runs west of Avenue de Novembre which is next to a park known as the Forest of Pines. The cemetery is in two sections, bisected by Rue Jalloul. In Memory of JOHN CRYAN Private L/2652 5th (Royal Irish) Lancers who died on Thursday, 21st June 1917. Age 28. Additional Information: Son of Thomas and Hanoria Cryan, of Townenane House, Monasteraden, Co. Sligo. Commemorative Information Cemetery: UNICORN CEMETERY, VEND'HUILE, Aisne, France Grave Reference/ Panel Number: II. H. 3. Location: Vendhuile is a village about 19 kilometres north of St Quentin and 24 kilometres south-east of Peronne. Unicorn Cemetery is about 3 kilometres south-west of Vendhuile on the west side of the road to the villages of Lempire and Ronssoy. In Memory of JANE CRYAN who died on Thursday, 13th March 1941. Age 74. Additional Information: at 9 Pattison Street, Dalmuir. Commemorative Information Cemetery: BURGH OF CLYDEBANK, Section of the Civilian War Dead Register In Memory of JAMES CRYAN who died on Sunday, 13th October 1940. Age 74. Additional Information: of 27 Hurworth Road. Injured 29 August 1940, at 27 Hurworth Road; died at Royal Infirmary. Commemorative Information Cemetery: COUNTY BOROUGH OF SHEFFIELD, YORKSHIRE (WEST RIDING), Section of the Civilian War Dead Register In Memory of J S CRYAN Second Lieutenant 218th Sqdn., Royal Air Force who died on Sunday, 11th August 1918. Commemorative Information Cemetery: ZEEBRUGGE CHURCHYARD, Brugge, West-Vlaanderen, Belgium Grave Reference/ Panel Number: 201. Location: Zeebrugge Churchyard is located in the Port town of Zeebrugge itself on the Sint Donaasstraat. The cemetery is approached via the N34 Kustlaan which passes through the town of Zeebrugge. Having passed the ferry port terminal continue northwards along the N34 (following the route of the tramlines) for 1.5 km. Sint Donaas church is a large red brick building with a slate roof. Having seen the church on the right hand side, turn right of the N34 onto the Sint Donaas kerk straat. The Commission cemetery is at the far right side of the churchyard surrounded by a red brick wall. In Memory of PATRICK CRYAN Private 2679 2nd Bn., Irish Guards who died on Wednesday, 13th September 1916. Commemorative Information Memorial: THIEPVAL MEMORIAL, Somme, France Grave Reference/ Panel Number: Pier and Face 7 D Location: The Thiepval Memorial will be found on the D73, off the main Bapaume to Albert road (D929).

 

Mon, 11 Sep 2000 06:00:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: [CRYAN] war graves

Sorry I missed two of the results. I am in Belgium at the moment and found out re: this site from our guide. I was at the Mennin Gate yesterday and tried to spot any Cryans etc and couldnt see any as there were so many names but there was as you shall see below!! In Memory of ROBERT CRYAN Private 51325 9th Bn., Royal Scots who died on Thursday, 1st August 1918. Age 19. Additional Information: Son of Catherine Cryan, of 1377, Maryhill Rd., Maryhill, Glasgow, and the late John Cryan. Commemorative Information Memorial: SOISSONS MEMORIAL, Aisne, France Location: The town of Soissons stands on the left bank of the River Aisne, approximately 100 kilometres north-east of Paris. The Soissons Memorial, which will be found in the public square, commemorates nearly 4,000 war dead from the 1914-1918 War who have no known grave. Its particular reference is to the Battles of the Aisne and Marne, 1918, in which comparatively small bodies of British troops played a conspicuous part in defeat and in victory. The memorial consists of a cenotaph before which stands the figures of three soldiers. Behind the memorial is a three-sided wall bearing the names of those officers and men who fell in this theatre of war and who have no known grave. The memorial register is kept at the Mairie where it may be consulted. In Memory of STEPHEN JOSEPH CRYAN Private 3786 31st Bn., Australian Infantry, A.I.F who died on Wednesday, 26th September 1917. Commemorative Information Memorial: YPRES (MENIN GATE) MEMORIAL, Ieper, West-Vlaanderen, Belgium Grave Reference/ Panel Number: Panel 7 - 17 - 23 - 25 - 27 - 29 - 31 Location: Ypres (now Ieper) is a town in the Province of West Flanders. The Memorial is situated at the eastern side of the town on the road to Menin and Courtrai, and bears the names of men who were lost without trace during the defence of the Ypres Salient in the First World War. Historical Information: A description of the Memorial and an account of the military operations in the Ypres Salient is contained in a separate Introductory part to the Registers.

Mon, 11 Sep 2000 06:07:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: [CRYAN] Commonwealth War Graves

I already sent this with more detail but it hasnt come through yet so I sen the full lis again just in case http://yard.ccta.gov.uk/cwgc/register.nsf Name Rank Regiment Date of Death CRYAN, H Ordinary Signalman Royal Navy 11th Apr 1946 CRYAN, J Private 5th (Royal Irish) Lancers 21st Jun 1917 CRYAN, J Civilian 13th Mar 1941 CRYAN, J Civilian 13th Oct 1940 CRYAN, J S Second Lieutenant Royal Air Force 11th Aug 1918 CRYAN, P Private Irish Guards 13th Sep 1916 CRYAN, R Private Royal Scots 1st Aug 1918 CRYAN, S J Private Australian Infantry, A.I.F 26th Sep 1917

Mon, 11 Sep 2000 06:12:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: [CRYAN] More Graves

Debt of Honour Register Here are the results of your enquiry. There are 30 records which match your search criteria. Select a name to see more details Name Rank Regiment Date of Death CREAN, A Private King's Own (Royal Lancaster Regt.) 15th Dec 1916 CREAN, A P Civilian 27th Sep 1940 CREAN, F Private Australian Infantry Base Depot 28th Dec 1914 CREAN, H Private The Buffs (East Kent Regiment) 30th Sep 1918 CREAN, J Private West Yorkshire Regt. (Prince of Wales's Own) 10th Nov 1915 CREAN, J Private South Wales Borderers 20th Jun 1915 CREAN, J Corporal Royal Garrison Artillery 2nd Jun 1918 CREAN, J Corporal Royal Air Force (Aux. Air Force) 7th Nov 1944 CREAN, J F Captain Lancashire Hussars 17th Oct 1918 CREAN, K Driver Royal Army Service Corps 24th Mar 1947 CREAN, P Private Royal Army Service Corps 18th Jun 1920 CREAN, P L Lance Corporal N.Z. Rifle Brigade 26th Jul 1916 CREAN, R A Private South Lancashire Regiment 8th Nov 1916 CREAN, T Private Canterbury Regiment, N.Z.E.F. 15th Oct 1917 CREAN, T Captain Royal Flying Corps 26th Oct 1914 CREAN, T Private Royal Army Service Corps 10th Dec 1919 CREAN, W J Leading Stoker Royal Navy 17th Nov 1940 CREANE, J Private Connaught Rangers 3rd Feb 1915 CREANEY, C Corporal Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers 21st Aug 1915 CREANEY, F Rifleman Royal Ulster Rifles 12th Aug 1943 CREANEY, J Private Connaught Rangers 11th Mar 1916 CREANEY, J Aircraftman 2nd Class Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 3rd Jun 1943 CREANEY, J Private Royal Irish Fusiliers 1st Jul 1916 CREANEY, J Fireman Merchant Navy 5th May 1941 CREANEY, J Private Highland Light Infantry 20th May 1917 CREANEY, M O Private Wellington Regiment, N.Z.E.F. 4th Oct 1917 CREANEY, S Gunner Royal Artillery 23rd Apr 1941 CREANEY, T Able Seaman Royal Canadian Navy Vol. Reserve 13th Sep 1942 CREANEY, T Private Seaforth Highlanders 20th Oct 1914 CREANEY, W J Private Special Air Service Regiment, A.A.C. 17th Jun 1944 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CRINES, H Private Duke of Wellington's (West Riding Regt.) 31st Jul 1921 Name Rank Regiment Date of Death CREHAN, J Private Leinster Regiment 9th Jun 1917 CREHAN, K Civilian 12th Mar 1941 CREHAN, M Private Durham Light Infantry 27th Mar 1918 CREHAN, M J Major Royal Canadian Infantry Corps 20th Oct 1944 CREHAN, T Private Connaught Rangers 2nd Jun 1917 CREHAN, T Sergeant Royal Air Force 24th Nov 1940 CREHAN, V J Private York and Lancaster Regiment 2nd Apr 1917 CREHAN, W L Corporal Royal Marines 2nd Oct 1942 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Name Rank Regiment Date of Death CRANE, A Corporal King's Own Yorkshire Light Infantry 3rd Sep 1917 CRANE, A Civilian 20th Feb 1943 CRANE, A Private The Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regt.) 8th Oct 1915 CRANE, A Private York and Lancaster Regiment 13th Sep 1916 CRANE, A Corporal South Wales Borderers 4th Jul 1917 CRANE, A Private Northumberland Fusiliers 8th Aug 1917 CRANE, A Private Royal Irish Regiment 11th Aug 1918 CRANE, A Sapper Royal Engineers 16th Oct 1914 CRANE, A Gunner Royal Artillery 26th Feb 1944 CRANE, A Gunner Royal Artillery 22nd Apr 1944 CRANE, A Private West Yorkshire Regt. (Prince of Wales's Own) 20th Aug 1917 CRANE, A Lance Corporal Middlesex Regiment 29th Sep 1915 CRANE, A Serjeant Leicestershire Regiment 13th Oct 1915 CRANE, A B Private East Surrey Regiment 11th Jun 1916 CRANE, A B Private London Regiment 8th Oct 1916 CRANE, A B E Corporal Australian Army Service Corps 9th Jun 1945 CRANE, A C Private Machine Gun Corps (Inf) 17th Jan 1920 CRANE, A C Engine Room Artificer Royal Canadian Navy 22nd Oct 1940 CRANE, A C Corporal Machine Gun Corps (Inf) 22nd Jul 1916 CRANE, A C G Ordinary Signalman Royal Navy 22nd Mar 1942 CRANE, A D Private Northamptonshire Regiment 16th Feb 1916 CRANE, A D Lance Bombardier Royal Artillery 9th Jun 1941 CRANE, A E Private Leicestershire Regiment 7th Nov 1918 CRANE, A E Pilot Officer Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 5th Jun 1942 CRANE, A E Corporal Royal Sussex Regiment 5th Aug 1944 CRANE, A E C Gunner Royal Australian Artillery 23rd Dec 1943 CRANE, A E J Corporal Lord Strathcona's Horse 1st Dec 1917 CRANE, A F Private Durham Light Infantry 29th Oct 1918 CRANE, A G Corporal Royal Australian Air Force 29th Jul 1946 CRANE, A G Private Royal Warwickshire Regiment 24th Jul 1918 CRANE, A H Rifleman King's Royal Rifle Corps 19th Sep 1917 CRANE, A H Private Northumberland Fusiliers 8th Oct 1918 CRANE, A J Private Royal Fusiliers 23rd Aug 1918 CRANE, A J Private Royal Fusiliers 24th Oct 1916 CRANE, A J V Sergeant Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 29th Jan 1945 CRANE, A L Rifleman Royal Ulster Rifles 1st Sep 1941 CRANE, A M A Civilian 11th May 1941 CRANE, A R Private Manchester Regiment 13th Sep 1917 CRANE, A R Private Tank Corps 29th Sep 1918 CRANE, A T Leading Telegraphist Royal Navy 24th Feb 1916 CRANE, A W Private Royal Fusiliers 15th Sep 1916 CRANE, B Trooper 142nd Regt. (7th Suffolks), R.A.C. 1st Aug 1943 CRANE, B D Flight Sergeant Royal Canadian Air Force 29th Sep 1942 CRANE, B K Corporal Australian Army Dental Corps 17th Nov 1943 CRANE, B L Sergeant Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 15th Mar 1943 CRANE, B W Driver Royal Corps of Signals 20th Jan 1943 CRANE, C Private Dorsetshire Regiment 1st Jul 1916 CRANE, C Leading Aircraftman Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 25th Nov 1943 CRANE, C Private Welsh Regiment 25th Aug 1918 CRANE, C Private Suffolk Regiment 21st Oct 1943 CRANE, C Lance Corporal 6th Dragoons (Inniskilling) 13th May 1915 CRANE, C A Private Grenadier Guards 25th Sep 1916 CRANE, C A Private London Regt (Royal Fusiliers) 7th Oct 1916 CRANE, C C Private West Yorkshire Regt. (Prince of Wales's Own) 24th Sep 1917 CRANE, C E Second Lieutenant Duke of Cornwall's Light Infantry 18th Sep 1914 CRANE, C E Lance Corporal Rifle Brigade 1st Apr 1917 CRANE, C G J Private Queen's Own Royal West Kent Regiment 31st Oct 1942 CRANE, C H Driver Royal Field Artillery 26th Apr 1919 CRANE, C H Private Worcestershire Regiment 6th Aug 1915 CRANE, C H Private Suffolk Regiment 10th Apr 1917 CRANE, C H A Petty Officer Royal Navy 28th Mar 1943 CRANE, C J Master Mercantile Marine 12th May 1918 CRANE, C J Sergeant Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 26th Jul 1944 CRANE, C R Corporal Australian Infantry, A.I.F 7th Nov 1917 CRANE, C V Private London Regiment 22nd Mar 1918 CRANE, C W Private Royal Army Medical Corps 13th Aug 1915 CRANE, C W Corporal Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 16th Jun 1944 CRANE, C W R Carpenter's Mate Naval Auxiliary Personnel (M.N.) 5th Nov 1940 CRANE, D Private Lancashire Fusiliers 7th Aug 1915 CRANE, D A Flying Officer Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve 28th Mar 1940 CRANE, D S Private Suffolk Regiment 16th Sep 1916 CRANE, D Y Civilian 19th Dec 1940 CRANE, E Private Middlesex Regiment 7th May 1917 CRANE, E Private Worcestershire Regiment 21st Aug 1916 CRANE, E Private South Wales Borderers 13th Jul 1917 CRANE, E Serjeant Royal Fusiliers 29th Apr 1917 CRANE, E Sapper Royal Engineers 13th Mar 1919 CRANE, E Gunner Royal Artillery 14th Nov 1942 CRANE, E Private Royal Army Ordnance Corps 6th May 1946 CRANE, E Private Northamptonshire Regiment 4th Mar 1917 CRANE, E B Driver Royal Field Artillery 16th Sep 1918 CRANE, E C Able Seaman Royal Navy 19th Dec 1941 CRANE, E E Driver Royal Field Artillery 1st May 1918 CRANE, E E Private Suffolk Regiment 21st Sep 1944 CRANE, E G Gunner Royal Field Artillery 19th Apr 1917 CRANE, E H Private Bedfordshire Regiment 2nd Nov 1918 CRANE, E H Captain Essex Regiment 3rd Dec 1943 CRANE, E J Private Canadian Infantry (Central Ontario Regt.) 30th Sep 1918 CRANE, E J Private Canadian Infantry (Eastern Ontario Regt.) 4th May 1917 CRANE, E J C Civilian 12th Jan 1941 CRANE, E P W Private Australian Infantry, A.I.F 3rd May 1917 CRANE, E S Private Middlesex Regiment 16th Aug 1917 CRANE, E W Rifleman Rifle Brigade 7th Apr 1941 CRANE, E W G Signalman Royal Corps of Signals 5th Sep 1942 CRANE, F Private Australian Infantry, A.I.F 4th Oct 1917 CRANE, F Corporal The Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regt.) 3rd May 1917 CRANE, F Private Suffolk Regiment 30th Sep 1915 CRANE, F Gunner Royal Artillery 21st Feb 1941 CRANE, F Lance Corporal Oxford. and Bucks Light Infantry 12th Jul 1915 CRANE, F Lance Corporal Manchester Regiment 4th Jun 1915

 

Tue, 12 Sep 2000 03:41:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: [CRYAN] war graves

Name Rank Regiment Date of Death CREGAN, C Private Leinster Regiment 12th Aug 1915 CREGAN, C Private Royal Scots Fusiliers 18th Jun 1915 CREGAN, C A Private Australian Infantry, A.I.F 5th Nov 1916 CREGAN, C T A Private Australian Infantry, A.I.F 27th Aug 1915 CREGAN, D L Rifleman Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, R.C.I.C. 17th Sep 1944 CREGAN, F M Private Devonshire Regiment 28th Jul 1916 CREGAN, J Private Yorkshire Regiment 10th Jul 1916 CREGAN, J E Private Canadian Infantry (Quebec Regt.) 16th Apr 1917 CREGAN, J E Private London Regt (Royal Fusiliers) 19th Sep 1918 CREGAN, J M Signalman Australian Corps of Signals 13th Feb 1945 CREGAN, N G Sub-Lieutenant (A) Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve 11th Oct 1946 CREGAN, P Private Cameronians (Scottish Rifles) 1st Dec 1917 CREGAN, P Able Seaman Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve 23rd May 1915 CREGAN, P Rifleman Royal Irish Rifles 16th Jun 1915 CREGAN, P J Private Leinster Regiment 27th Oct 1915 CREGAN, R C H Rifleman Rifle Brigade 20th Jan 1943

 

Fatarm@aol.com Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 21:47:31 EDT Subject: Re: hi To: caoimhghin@yahoo.com

Yes you did, some time ago, thank you.And I'm sorry it's taking me so

long to reply lately.I'm reconstructing my life after that nasty last

year, and I'm just not getting online as much as I should.I'll do better!Hope

all is well with you, Leslie

 

Fatarm@aol.com Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 22:01:54 EDT Subject: [CRYAN] Fwd: subscribe

I believe I have received Cryan information before from this group, but have not been able to share in the discussion because I had so little to go on. Now that "Karen" has helped me out in some previous e-mail messages, I have info. on grandfather, great-grandfather and great-great grandfather and mother. I would like any additional information on Michael Cryan and Bridget Foley Cryan (Crien) that anyone might wish to share. Eve has sent me their marriage information from the RC parish registers of Ballaghadereen, which she says is a town on the borders of Counties Rosecommon, Mayo and Sligo. I would like to continue the search. Thank you so much EVE! for the latest puzzle piece. Dottie in Corpus Christi

 

Fatarm@aol.com Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 22:13:37 EDT Subject: Re: [CRYAN] Robert CRYAN

Thank you for checking.Hope you didn't have to go too far out of your

way.Too bad you're not a Fox researcher too!You've done a great job,

thanks.Leslie

Thomas Crane" <tccrane@peoplepc.com To: <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: Regarding the "Debt of Honour Register>"

Tue, 12 Sep 2000 20:25:00 -0700

Dear O Croidheain, I saw the above mentioned list on the Cryan rootsweb. I would be interested to know how a person might be able to access the details regarding each name. Reference was made regarding that possibility, but since the information that you forwarded was fixed information that option was not available. You might be interested to know that my great-grandfather's name was Patrick Crehan. He was born in 1844, locale not as yet definitely determined, although I did confirm that he worked as a miner in the Silvermines that are located near Nenagh, Tipperary. He was working there when he married my great-grandmother, Mary Cuddihy (b.1846,d.1910) in August of 1863. Their daughter, also named Mary, was born in Dec. 1864. They immigrated to America in 1866 or 1867 where their other children were born and both Patrick and his sons worked in the various coal fields until they finally settled in Illinois where I located them on the US Census of 1880 as living in Springfield, Illinois. I would be pleased to hear from you as you seem to have gathered some rather interesting information regarding the Cryan, Crean, Crehan, Crane Clan. Best wishes, Thomas Crane

Wed, 13 Sep 2000 04:49:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Caoimhghin O Croidheain <caoimhghin@yahoo.com Subject: [CRYAN] Re: Regarding the "Debt of Honour Register>"

Hi I always enclose the url of the site I have researched so that interested persons can search for themselves. Just click on the site address http://yard.ccta.gov.uk/cwgc/register.nsf and on the site you will see Search the Register. A form will appear and you can put in the name - dont specify by filling in any other fields and a list will be returned. Also if you are new to the list you can see all past emails on my site www.geocities.com/caoimhghin if you are not on the list maybe Leslie could write to you and encourage you to join in the research..... regards caoimhghin

Jill Devito <devito@uta.edu> Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 14:40:27 -0500 Subject: [CRYAN] St. Patrick's Cemetery Burial Records, Lowell

Attention Lowell Cryan researchers:

Here is a new, improved version of the St. Patrick's Cemetery burial

recordsthat Joan Ogg photocopied & I organized by plot groupings.It contains

notes for everyone I could link together from other sources.

Also, Karen, I was wondering if you might have obits for the family

membersof Thomas Cryan of Bolt Street (Annie M, James J, and Joseph F)?.

Thanks!Jill

 

St. Patrick's Cemetery Burial Records 1894-1998

 

Yard 3, Lot 21age††††††††† burial date†† appx birth††† relationship

†††††††††††††††††††† Sarah A†††††† 29†††††††††††††††† 1/17/05††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1876†† (1st wife of John P.

Cryan)

†††††††††††††††††††† John J††††††††† 0†††††††††††††††††† 2/14/01††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1901†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† (infant son of John

Cryan and Sarah Igo?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Margaret†††† 0†††††††††††††††††† 11/25/04†††††† b 1904†††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† (infant

daughter of†† ††"†††††††††††††††† "†††††† "?)

 

Yard 4, Lot 23

†††††††††††††††††††† James†††††††††† 56†††††††††††††††† 12/18/20†††††† b abt 1864†† (son of James J.

Cryan & Sarah McMahon)

†††††††††††††††††††† Bridget††††††† 80†††††††††††††††† 1/7/49††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1869†† (daughter†† "

"†††††††††† "††††††††††† "†††††††††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† Katherine F 84†††††††††††††††† 2/11/57††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1873†† (daughter

"†††† ††††††"†††††††††† "††††††††††† "†††††††††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† John P†††††††† 65†††††††††††††††† 1/26/40††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1875†† (son of Michael

Cryan & Bridget Foley)

†††††††††††††††††††† Sarah B††††††† 71†††††††††††††††† 7/14/11††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1838†† (S. McMahon, wife of

James J. Cryan)

†††††††††††††††††††† Elizabeth†††† 6†††††††††††††††††† 11/11/11†††††† b abt 1905†† (daughter of

Alexander T. Cryan??)

†††††††††††††††††††† Robert W††† 29†††††††††††††††† 6/26/56††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1927†† (Korean

War?)

 

Yard 4, Lot 26

†††††††††††††††††††† Harriet V††††† 79†††††††††††††††† 4/30/54††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1875†† (listed as

Harriet V., Mrs. - Lowell Directory)

†††††††††††††††††††† Vincent††††††† 0†††††††††††††††††† 4/24/23††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1923

 

Yard 5B, Lot 2

†††††††††††††††††††† Thomas†††††† 74†††††††††††††††† 3/28/37††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1863†† (son of Michael

Cryan, variety store?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Julia M††††††† 60†††††††††††††††† 6/5/25††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1865†† (wife of Thomas -

see Lowell Directory)

 

Yard 5B, Lot 14

†††††††††††††††††††† John†††††††††††† 64†††††††††††††††† 2/5/39††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1874††††††††† (son of James J. Cryan &

Sarah McMahon)

†††††††††††††††††††† Anna G††††††† 50†††††††††††††††† 4/6/36††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1884††††††††† (wife of John above; Jill's

g-grandparents)

†††††††††††††††††††† James Y†††††† 81†††††††††††††††† 2/2/90††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1908††††††††† (son of John P. Cryan & Anna

O'Reilly)

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary K††††††† 86†††††††††††††††† 1/8/96††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1910†† (M. Cassidy, wife of

James U. Cryan above)

†††††††††††††††††††† Thomas†††††† 23†††††††††††††††† 6/18/49††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1920††††††††† (Lt. T. Cryan KIA WWII Mar

18, 1944)

 

Yard 5B, Lot 31

†††††††††††††††††††† Thomas E††† 62†††††††††††††††† 9/16/34††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1872

†††††††††††††††††††† Delia††††††††††† 79†††††††††††††††† 6/25/54††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1875

†††††††††††††††††††† Bridget††††††† 0†††††††††††††††††† 11/11/94†††††† b 1894 (?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Gertrude††††† 3†††††††††††††††††† 10/28/99†††††† b abt 1896

†††††††††††††††††††† Madeline†††† 84†††††††††††††††† 12/22/92†††††† b abt 1908

 

Yard 5B, Lot 33

†††††††††††††††††††† James J††††††† 35†††††††††††††††† 10/22/09†††††† b abt 1874

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary A†††††† 49†††††††††††††††† 9/14/24††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1875†† (wife of James J -

see Lowell Directory)

 

Yard 5B, Lot 31

†††††††††††††††††††† Nellie†††††††††† 2†††††††††††††††††† 8/24/07††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1905

†††††††††††††††††††† RosemaryA 85†††††††††††††††† 12/22/79†††††† b abt 1894

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary E††††††† 0†††††††††††††††††† 2/26/94††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b 1894 or 1994?

 

Yard 5C, Lot 8

†††††††††††††††††††† Annie M†††† 62†††††††††††††††† 6/30/16††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1854†† (wife of Thomas

Cryan below)

†††††††††††††††††††† Thomas†††††† 65†††††††††††††††† 4/15/10††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1855†† (son of James Cryan

& Mary Phillip)

†††††††††††††††††††† Annie G†††††† 92†††††††††††††††† 11/22/72†††††† b abt 1880†† (A.J. McGuane, wife

of Alexander T. Cryan)

†††††††††††††††††††† James J††††††† 27†††††††††††††††† 11/18/08†††††† b abt 1881†† (son of Thomas Cryan

and Mary above)

†††††††††††††††††††† Alexander T†††††††††††††††††††† 75†††††††††††††††† 3/27/56††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1881†† (son of

James J. Cryan & Sarah McMahon)

 

Yard 5D, Lot 3

†††††††††††††††††††† Michael†††††† 50†††††††††††††††† 6/9/99††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1849†† (son of James Cryan

& Mary Phillip)

†††††††††††††††††††† Bridget††††††† 73†††††††††††††††† 12/20/21†††††† b abt 1848†† (B. Foley, wife of

Michael Cryan above)

†††††††††††††††††††† Bridget††††††† 75†††††††††††††††† 1/16/48††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1873†† (daughter of Michael

Cryan & Bridget Foley)

†††††††††††††††††††† Annie††††††††† 47†††††††††††††††† 11/13/22†††††† b abt 1875†† (††††† "

"†††††††††† "†††††††††††† "††††††††† "†††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† Margaret†††† 82†††††††††††††††† 9/16/59††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1877†† (††††† "

"†††††††††† "†††††††††††† "††††††††† "†††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† Nellie†††††††††† 58†††††††††††††††† 9/27/39††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1881†† (††††† "

"†††††††††† "†††††††††††† "††††††††† "†††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† Michael J.†† 28†††††††††††††††† 5/8/11††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1883†† (son of

"†††††††††† "†††††††††††† "††††††††† "†††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† James ††††††††† 55†††††††††††††††† 1/27/39††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1884†† (son of

"†††††††††† "†††††††††††† "††††††††† "†††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† Nora E†††††††† 52†††††††††††††††† 9/3/38††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1886†† (daughter of††††† "

"†††††††††††† "††††††††† "†††† )

 

Yard 5D, Lot 17

†††††††††††††††††††† Margaret A 68†††††††††††††††† 2/13/34††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1866

 

Yard 5E, Lot 40

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary††††††††††† 73†††††††††††††††† 8/1/02††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1829†† (wife of Michael

Cryan, variety store?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Edward J†††† 83†††††††††††††††† 5/22/45††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1862†† (son of

Michael & Mary above?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Annie††††††††† 75†††††††††††††††† 8/14/43††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1868†† (daughter††† "

"††††††† "†††† ?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary††††††††††† 95†††††††††††††††† 9/22/83††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1888

 

Yard 6, Lot 6

†††††††††††††††††††† Margaret M†††††††††††††††††††† 82†††††††††††††††† 4/28/47††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1865

†††††††††††††††††††† Martin†††††††† 61†††††††††††††††† 3/31/36†††††††† †††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1875†† (of Martin &

Michael, Cryan Bros.?)

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary E††††††† 25†††††††††††††††† 2/4/20††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1895

†††††††††††††††††††† John†††††††††††† 59†††††††††††††††† 11/18/54†††††† b abt 1895

†††††††††††††††††††† James†††††††††† 65†††††††††††††††† 6/28/66††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1901

†††††††††††††††††††† Katherine††† 12†††††††††††††††† 3/29/18††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1906

 

Yard 6, Lot 25

†††††††††††††††††††† Bridget††††††† 70†††††††††††††††† 11/20/12†††††† b abt 1842†† (B. Leighton, wife

of Timothy Cryan)

†††††††††††††††††††† Hannah†††††† 56†††††††††††††††† 8/17/20††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1864†† (daughter of Timothy

& Bridget above)

†††††††††††††††††††† Mary††††††††††† 56†††††††††††††††† 2/20/25††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1869†† (daughter"†††††† "

"†††††††† "††††† )

†††††††††††††††††††† Annie††††††††† 88†††††††††††††††† 11/21/62†††††† b abt 1874†† (daughter"†††††† "

"†††††††† "††††† )

Yard --, Lot 63A

†††††††††††††††††††† John J††††††††† 74†††††††††††††††† 2/4/75††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1901

†††††††††††††††††††† Irene††††††††††† 68†††††††††††††††† 3/24/75††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1907†† (wife of John J -

see Lowell Directory)

 

Yard --, Lot 107

†††††††††††††††††††† Timothy J††† 52†††††††††††††††† 5/8/70††††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1918†† (son of

Alexander T. Cryan)

†††††††††††††††††††† Rita M†††††††† 12†††††††††††††††† 11/2/35††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1923†† (a.k.a. Rose, dau.

of Alexander T. Cryan?)

 

Yard --, Lot 487

†††††††††††††††††††† Thomas E††† 52†††††††††††††††† 5/26/52††††††††††††††††††††††††††††† b abt 1900

 

Yard --, Lot 698

†††††††††††††††††††† Joseph F†††† 72†††††††††††††††† 12/26/56†††††† b abt 1884†† (son of

Thomas & Annie M. Cryan??)

Thomas Crane" <tccrane@peoplepc.com> | To: <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: Thanks Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 19:50:39 -0700

Dear Caoimhghin, Thanks for the URL. I intend to search the data. Also, I am already on the list and have communicated with Leslie a number of times. I will search through your past correspondence as it appears that you have some interesting information. Best wishes, Thomas (Crehan) Crane

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > | To: "Caoimhghin O Croidheain" <caoimhghin@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: hi Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 09:30:49 +0100

Hi , Thanks for your email. No I have not received anything since the 13 Sept. I think that people are mailing each other off the list. I know that there has been a conversation between all the Lowell Cryans , one of which I have had contact with recently. The last email I received through the list was from that conversation. One thing that folk have asked me about, is the Cryan meeting that was to have taken place in about June. Did it ? What Happened ? I am intrigued. Perhaps ,if you have time to write something it could be put in a way that invites response by others and gets the Cryan dialogue started again. Are you still usually at the address in Swords ? I know that you have been away. I have something to send that MAY be of interest and I would like you to get it, and it not spend time chasing from address to address. About my search.....do you know anything about Culleenatreen/Flagford area and the civil parish of Killumnod ? I know you have connections with Croghan which is not far away. I have found a death registered in Carrick-on -Shannon which fits my criteria and may be gggrandpa. When I have finished my current set of films at the LDS I shall look at the parish records in the hope they are not too faded to see........I ought to put this on the list. Until again Eve

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 09:36:46 +0100 Subject: [CRYAN] Fw: [IRL-SLIGO] Co. Sligo Web-site

Hi all, You are VERY quiet at the moment !!!!!!!!! This website may be of interest to those who come from the NW of o Sligo. I notice that the writer is interested in the name FARRIS and I know that there are CRYAN/FARRIS links from this area. I hope that this produces something useful Eve

FamSpack" < > From: "FamSpack" < > | Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 09:52:38 +0100

Hi all, The list is so quiet, that I thought this could stimulate some replies - TO THE LIST - and keep the dialogue going. I sent the following in answer to some questions Perhaps others could help to answer the questions and fill in the gaps that I could not. ................. To answer your questions 1 Irish Roots magazine - I have seen issues of it but do not possess any - perhaps you could ask about subscriptions on the CRYAN website. Just send your message/question to CRYAN-L@rootsweb.com . I personally have so much to do that magazines just get in the way and add to our gigantic storage problems. 2 Sligo Abbey - my brother visited the place a years or so ago and brought back a guide with photographs and said the tomb was still there though the Abbey really a Friary is ruined but with walls still standing. 3 As far as I know my CRYAN Family all came to England where I now live.I know all the descendent of those who came to England but can not find where they came from. That is why I am going through the parish records one by one. But thank you so much for the offer of help, it was a kind thought. I will keep it in mind as one never knows. There are other lines that I am persuing that each have one family member who "crossed the pond" - but that is not so interesting as the CRYANs. 4 For John P CRYAN born 1875 son of Bridget and Michael, I wonder had you lookedat the LDS film of Ballaghadereen parish registers that I am sure that I have mentioned before. I only extracted details of CRYANs up to 1870. I am sure that you can find more about your family and about the FOLEY parents and family that I did not even look at. It is also so exciting to look at the original entries even though they are on film.. >From the Irish Indexes to the regitration of Births there are only 2 John CRYANs registered in 1875 John Sligo index number 7.338 John Boyle 9.106.... this is the more likely in 1874 there 4 registered John Tobercurry.........14.529 John Boyle .............14.82 John Boyle ...............19.89 John Boyle ................4.106 Take your pick as none have a second name. I think that I would check the parish registers first before sending for a b irth certificate. 5 Immigration or Naturalisation would seem to be a good start for entry into the USA. However,have you looked at the Ellis Island Website ? You may find something on the "Wall" but I am not sure whether it includes people who went to Boston.i do know that there are CRYANs there. 6 No,I do not have details about mystic wells but I do have a book which gives Holy Wells which were places of pilgrimage in Co Sligo 7 Have you looked a the ARCHIVES of the CRYAN newsgroup as there is lots of stuff there of the type of item 6 that was discussed in the past .............................. DOES ANYONE on the list have the URL for the Group ARCHIVES ? Happy Hunting, until again Eve

 

ariley@ltp.org> From: "A. Riley" <ariley@linux.ltp.org> Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 10:41:11 -0500 Subject: [CRYAN] [CRYAN-L] Mark Cryan/Crane/Crain

Here's an update on our research -- and if anyone has any other clues to add, we'll be grateful! Our ancestor, Atty McDonough Cryan, brought her children (all baptized at Taunagh parish, 1826-1844), to Boston in June 1848 aboard the Epaminondas. We've heard that her brother-in-law Mark Cryan/Crane/Crain, had come to the states earlier. Now we have a little more info on the brother-in-law but not much! According to his gravestone in Eldorado, Wisconsin, in the same cemetery as Atty and many of her children, next to the little church whose land was bought by Atty's son Patrick, Mark Crain was born in 1805, died February 12, 1880, age 75. He was married to Winnifred Lang, who died January 16, 1899, age 66 -- so she was born 1833, quite a bit younger than her husband. They had two daughters who died in childhood: Mary died March 20, 1864, age 7 (so born 1857), and Sarah died March 23, 1864, age 3 (born 1861). Mark and Winnifred had a son Mark who married Nellie Bluitt, an Eldorado neighbor, November 24, 1897. That's what little we know! But that gives us more clues to help us confirm John and Mark's people back in Ireland. Eve on this list and some researchers on the Leitrim Roscommon website have contributed information, and here's what we have. Notice the name Lucas for the the father in these baptisms -- There aren't any Lukes in later generations, and that's what gives me that bit of doubt. But if anyone who has these CDs can confirm a Mark born to Lucas and Winifred Crien, that'll clinch it. -- Here's John's baptism. CRIEN, Joannes Christening Sex: Male Christening Date: 16 May 1804 Recorded in: Roman Catholic, Aghanagh, Sligo, Ireland Father: Lucas CRIEN Mother: Winefrida BRENAN Source: FHL Number 989739 Dates: 1803-1864 -- A brother for John! I wish the first name was there! CRIEN, Christening Sex: Male Christening Date: 11 Apr 1807 Recorded in: Roman Catholic, Aghanagh, Sligo, Ireland Father: Lucas CRIEN Mother: Winifreda BRENAN Source: FHL Number 989739 Dates: 1803-1864 -- Here's Atty's baptism. MC DONOUGH, Aracte Christening Sex: Female Christening Date: 4 Jul 1804 Recorded in: Roman Catholic, Aghanagh, Sligo, Ireland Father: Timotheus MC DONOUGH Mother: Aracte WALSH Source: FHL Number 989739 Dates: 1803-1864 -- A sister for Atty! MC DONAGH, Anna Christening Sex: Female Christening Date: 27 Feb 1817 Recorded in: Roman Catholic, Aghanagh, Sligo, Ireland Father: Timotheus MC DONAGH Mother: Attia WALSH Source: FHL Number 989739 Dates: 1803-1864 -- Here's John & Atty's marriage. CRYAN, Johanem Marriage Wife: Aractam MCDONAGH Marriage Date: 14 Mar 1825 Recorded in: Roman Catholic, Boyle, Roscommon, Ireland Source: FHL Number 989743 Dates: 1792-1863 Thanks for all the help, cousins Another proud descendant of Atty McDonough Cryan A. Riley ariley@ltp.org